Hokkaido to the Himalayas: Tour Leader Phill Freeman Shares Stories of Adventure and Safety

Hey,

welcome to episode 96, almost at 100 of the Arrive Alive podcast.

My name is Len Bellello, your happy and humble host. This is going to be a very,

very special show. We have a guest that has ridden all over the world,

including Japan, he has his own company, which is a motorcycle touring company.

The name of that company is MotoQuest, and our guest's name is Phil Freeman.

Now, Phil, I was introduced to Phil when I was first starting the show from my

friend Robert, who had taken two MotoQuest motorcycle tours, and if you don't know

about MotoQuest, you're definitely going to learn a lot about it, but The short

story is that they are a world -renowned touring company.

They specialize in groups of, you know, 8 and 12, not more than that, people,

riders, and in many different countries, from India to Europe to America,

South America, Mexico. And Phil started the company. And I was also introduced to

Phil from Mr. Eric Anderson, who suggested that I have Phil and his friend Aline

Martinez. Now, Aline was on, and Phil kind of helped her because, you know, Aline's

English was, you know, not the best. It was serviceable, but Phil definitely helped.

Because if you may remember, and I'll put links to the show notes, Aileen rode her

motorcycle from the southern tip of South America to just about as far north you

can go in North America without getting arrested by the military, okay?

And that was a great, great episode and I tell people about that a lot. And

because she's from South America, I ride with a lot of guys from South America and

Colombia and Brazil. So that's an episode that a lot of them appreciate.

So anyway, but we're having Phil on today because, for a couple of reasons. Number

one, Phil, because of his leading all these tours, he sees people riding that have

different skill levels, and he sees them on bikes that they've never rode before for

the most part, and he guides them on all different types of terrain and weather and

seasons. So I thought it would be good to have him on the show. Now, the other

reason is it's times like these you know it's December it's cold north of the mason

dixon line a lot of us are thinking hey what is the tour that we're going to do

this year you know for me this year it was my Niagara Falls tour and one thing I

decided about that trip last year is I'm going to do that every year that I'm

riding so and then I'll do another tour because I love that trip so much it was

so so amazing but you know what a lot of us are thinking what tours we're going

to do next year And I know a lot of us are solo.

stories, the food, and things like that. So that's why we have Phil on today.

I just want to remind you, please share the show with friends, and even people you

hate, no, I'm just kidding, but friends and family who ride, and we have something

very special coming up in towards the middle of this month. Instead of doing 12

days of Christmas, we're going to do 12 podcasts in 12 days with 12 different

safety tips, and we're going to have some special guests on the show, on those

shows as well. So without further adieu, it's my pleasure to introduce to you,

Mr. Phil Freeman, coming to us from Anchorage, Alaska. Mama Mia.

And Phil, you are the CEO and head honcho over at most.

old woman named Phyllis who lives in Edison, New Jersey. Tell her about MotoQuest

motorcycle tours, whether it would be good for her, her dad who rides, or even her

mom who rides. Tell us a little bit about what you guys do and how you do it.

Okay. I would say that, you know, we're a relatively small, we're a small business,

and we were started in 1998, so we've been at it over 25 years. Wow. Okay. And

what we offer is a fleet of BMWGS models for rent up and down the West Coast.

So you can come in and independently rent a motorcycle in Long Beach and Portland,

Oregon, and Anchorage, Alaska. And we also offer tours, organized tours in the United

States and all over the world. We feature 20 countries in our menu. And you can

ride and they can be as rustic or as foo -foo as you want and we have a little

bit of everything and when we go abroad we ride everything so there's nothing off

the table from dirt roads to himalayas royal infields to triumph tigers and and then

the isle of man so we we have a lot for someone if they got into our program

they would meet a lot of interesting like -minded people. And you don't have to be

a tour taker. We have a lot of people that come through the doors like that. And

then they like it. They like the format. There are different brands or different

styles in the industry. Or you could just get a one -way ride and pick up a bike

in Portland, Oregon, for example, in May. And then ride all the way up to Alaska

and there and fly home. Call it again. And they could have lunch with you at the

Panera bread in Anchorage. Absolutely. Oh, and they can go all the way to Cabo,

too, if they want on the bike. So our motorcycle range is anywhere, basically the

Rockies West. It is our playground, all the way up through Canada, all the way down

to Cabo San Lucas. Those motorcycles will go all the way to Pruto Bay, the same

motorcycles that stay in our fleet for three years, mostly. So, you know, I don't

know if you know a fellow named John Del Vecchio. He travels, he's a high school

business teacher, but in the summer on the weekends, he teaches a cornering class,

and he had a DVD class, and then he'll do it at Lake George, and he'll do it at

various, the BMW rally, and that type of thing. And he lives in Rochester, New

York, and he's a great guy, salt of the earth dude. But, you know, we have a

running joke where I joke with him because he's in Rochester, you know, Northern New

York. And I say, hey, John, what's your writing season? Like, you know, July to end

of August type thing. And he always gets a little upset when I kind of joke about

that. But with you, I mean, in Anchorage, Alaska, now, just be honest with me.

You look like an honest dude. Tell me, honestly, on the average year,

what is the first day that people in Anchorage are getting their motor? Is it, is

it like mid -May? Is it late May? Okay, we're not talking about the Hardy Souls

that ride trikes with bike tires. Yeah, not like the heated group dudes. Yeah.

They're all year long, but you'll see motorcycles out, whether,

you know, depending on the weather, anywhere from the last week of April, but

basically,

we won't rent anymore and that first two weeks of May we won't rent because we

can't bank on but it's basically mid -May to mid -September it's uh and you know if

you look at sometimes even in the mid -summer you'll see the temperatures of

fairbanks and it'll be uh it'll be hotter than it is in Orlando really wow and

with the with the 18 hours and 20 hours of of of sunlight like Like, you know, we

have our, I don't know if you guys do a two -wheel Tuesday. You know what Two -Wil

Tuesdays is, right? But we have several clubs that meet, you know, bi -weekly or two

-times a week. Yeah, we have two -wheel Tuesday. We'll go to Brooklyn or have you

ever ridden in New York City, by the way. I have not. I have traveled around there

on my feet. You got to come out here. Let's go for a run. I'll take you around.

I appreciate that. Thank you. Oh, yeah, we have like anywhere from, you know, three

to 700 people every single Tuesday. I mean, it starts like first Tuesday in May is

when, you know, a lot of the, no offense to any women listening, but we don't get

a, until the weather goes up to about 74 degrees, we don't get a lot of women for

whatever reason. But once it gets over 74, the ratio's like 50, 50. But before

that, it's like 80, 20 for whatever freaking reason. I don't know why, but anyway.

Now, let me ask you this before we get into the safety and your tours, okay,

you're growing up in Anchorage.

Did you have any friends or family that wrote? How did you get involved in

motorcycling in a place that doesn't really typically lend itself to riding? Yeah,

and you're right about that. It's a short season. Many people will buy a motorcycle

and then quickly sell it. There's only four long highways up here and there's only

four months a year and many times that motorcycle will be Alaska plated and it'll

be sent down to Arizona or something so that the Alaskan can ride longer. And I

was not into motorcycles. You know, ATVs are big up here. I went over to a

friend's house and got on a, he had a dirt bike and I rode up and down the

street twice when I was maybe a teen. And that was it. My dad didn't ride,

but my uncle started getting into writing. It's always somebody, isn't it? It's

Uncle, you know, Uncle Bob and Uncle Skip. That's me. They rode motorcycles and I

didn't see it coming at all. But then I ended up getting a job in Japan as a

English teacher and I was there for two years. I didn't know I was going to be

there for two years, just one year. And when I first showed up on the northern

island of Hokkaido, I noticed something right away that I wanted to be a part of.

And it was all these motorcycle travelers on this really sleepy back road where I

lived in a little town of 200 people. They were going by all day long. Everything

from mopeds to Harleys were going by me with all of their luggage strapped to the

back, their tents, everything. What are we talking? Is in early 90s?

1994 to 96 is when I was there. That's when you were teaching English in Japan.

Yep. And I would go every, almost every day I commuted along this reservoir. And

there was a campground down there. And it was like $3 a night. And there was a

grove of trees with nice manicured lawn all the way to the shores. And I would

marvel at all the motorcycles tucked up under all the trees with tents in the

evening and then the next morning they're all gone and they're all somewhere else

and then you realize there's this huge migration of people on the move and everybody

that wants to travel by motorcycle in Japan goes to Hokkaido,

the Northern Island and it's much like the Alaska of Japan and it was everywhere

and it was so much that if you got on a cycle your hand would barely touch the

the handlebar because you're waving so many times it's ridiculous it's a it's a and

everybody gauge themselves as how many times they've been to Hokkaido as a Japanese

rider well I saw that and I wanted to be a part of it and one of my teachers my

colleagues had five motorcycles and one of them was the old Honda 1982 kickstart xr

250 and he said you can't was that the blue and orange it was red or orange it

was faded okay and and he said you know what you can buy this from me while

you're here and you can use it and then i'll buy it back so it was a long rental

basically yeah and he didn't use it he felt sorry for it and i did too so i i

bought it from him and That was your first time riding? Yeah, and I went around

and around the island over and over and over again, and I even rode down to the

main island once with a ferry crossing back and forth, and I camped all over the

place. I went to all the points and went all the side roads. You know how it is.

I went crazy. I just fell in love right there. I hear you, man. You know, mine,

I lived on a dead end street, and this older kid down the block had a had a mini

bike with a tecumsa engine that you had to pull to start and and the brakes were

your feet basically and I crashed it into a Plymouth Fury you know after 40 yards

but the first 30 yards I said holy crap this is amazing and and then when I was

20 no it's 21 or 22 I split a Harley Sportster with my friend Stephen,

whose other car or other vehicle was a 1969 Chevelle Super Sport,

Candy Blue, with tires as big as wide as you and me on the back and bicycle tires

on the front, running nitrous in the back, and he was blind as a bat, but that

thing would do wheelies. So he liked speed. Now, the Harley wasn't very speedy, but,

you know, when you're 21. And so that was like my first bike. But in the 90s, I

don't know if you remember this bike. My first new motorcycle was a Yamaha Radian.

Do you remember that bike? No. It came from the FJ 600 engine. It was like a

parts bike where the guys that Yamaha wanted to leave early one day. And they're

like, okay, let's just put a bike together. And it was, you know, it's very much

like my BMW 100 are, which is what I have now. And I've had for a while. It does

everything well. You know, it won't go, it won't jump hills, but it'll do dirt

roads, you know, and any there. So, I digress. All right, let's talk a little bit

about the tours, too. Now, you were saying everything from foo to rustic. So what's

the most foo -food place that you guys have on the tours? I don't know. For

example, Portugal, there's a spa. There's chocolate's on the pillow. There's a fine

dining in the restaurant if you want it. The rooms are nice. You know, your four

and five star. So. And then the most rustic would be, would that be the

Southwestern tour? I always say maybe we're getting into India where you have tent

camps. They're glamping, but there's really not too much to write home about.

They're very proud about This is even on the food and everything, but it's pretty

basic. And you have a toilet, but you have maybe a faucet next to that. And you

have like a little water container, and you use that as your flush mechanism.

Okay. That's on the rustic side for sure. Yeah, you're 15 ,000 feet. And there's

really nothing up there except for you. Yeah. Got it. Okay. And now,

as far as the tour guides, guides. I know you can rent the motorcycles by yourself,

as you mentioned.

As far as the tour guides, are they,

obviously you vet them, you talk to them. I'm sure, have they been with you a

while? Do they live? I guess one of my questions is, do they live there? Are they

native? Or do they live other places and just go to those places to lead the

tours? Well, our mixture is this. We have a core set of guides and some of them

have specialties and some of them are natives from that place or at least they

speak the native language okay because that's really important and most of them are

Americans though we dabble with the odd Portuguese or English here and there and

then we generally blend that with a driver that is a mechanic mechanic also,

and they are local. That's pretty important for us. Or if they're not, they have

another skill that they bring to the table that they're not so local, but they can

do the job. They have the experience. So to experience people in that realm,

and it seems to work really well. And we find that, you know, most of our guests

are Americans. we have a spattering of English and Canadians and the odd European

and Japanese, but mostly these our guides are also Americans.

So there is a good parallel culture, you know, attachment there. You know,

you already know who you're dealing with. And we make sure that the guides reach

out and contact each person before they get on a tour personally, so they have a

rapport as well. Because we feel, you know, you need two things. You need a guide

that's competent. It's a good face for the company that also takes care of

everybody's needs. But you also need that relationship between the rider who doesn't

know the guide. They're actually throwing something to the wind in a way and coming

with us and taking a chance. And you want to nurture it and respect that

relationship as well. I feel like that's part. Yeah. And this is great to know. I

appreciate it. Is there like more than one guide per trip? Like is it one or two,

depending? Well, generally we have two staff for 12 people for 12 people. Got it.

Or we say 12 motorcycles because once you get over 12 motorcycles, you start talking

about, yeah, an extra five minutes when you stop. That extra 10 or 20 minutes, the

other person that might be late to the briefing and the other things in logistics

that I'm with trying to see a bigger group in a small like mom and pop restaurant

in the day. You know, it's all the things start to compile more and more once you

get over a group. So, you know, we have some competitors that will take 20

motorcycles on their trip. And you're just, you're, you're just in the line of a

bunch of ducklings the whole time. And that's fine for people who need that or want

that and they're or they come from a culture like that but americans i can

guarantee you i can spot a group of americans from a mile away and you know why

because they do not do anything together they will the minute they got two seconds

they're all on the phone one of them's going over one way another one's going it's

like a bunch of five -year -olds and they're just gone you've lost them whereas if

you have a group of oh i'm going to stereotype here but i have had groups that

are all all Japanese or all German. These guys are great. They'll stay right in

your front pocket. They're hanging out. They want to be told what to do. And then

when you ride, you can see them all in your rear of your mirror, no problem.

Americans, good luck.

Hey, we'll be right back with the rest of the show. But first, I want to tell you

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we'll have a link on the show notes and hopefully you won't need them this year

but you never know, keep it handy and now back to the rest of the show. Yeah,

and but as far as it's, you know, we ride I mean we ride weekends and sometimes

we'll get 70 people and we try to go out in three groups which never really works

right and we haven't, we had one and then one and a half nothing too bad but we

ride almost every saturday do like 150 miles let's oh let's talk about that so all

right 12 bikes that's totally cool uh the fact so um what's the average mileage of

a day i'm sure it's going to vary by city but is there a low medium and high

mileage that these that these people are doing every day yeah you can you know

average is probably 200 oh that's not bad at all you know get up be at the you

know parking lot at your bikes at nine um get in around four stop once an hour

either i call it a give and get you're either taking on water or you're getting

rid of water right uh maybe an hour or so for lunch maybe a picnic lunch depending

on the day just grab something and go uh that kind of thing the tendency for these

riders too is if you give them the option between sitting in a

the table. And I try to feel them out and figure out how the canter of the day

is going to go. And, you know, I try to figure out what's the best for everybody,

not for the super alpha that wants to ride 500 miles crush it or the one that

could would have been happy just to be in their pajamas until noon. And then maybe

ride eight miles. Got it. Okay. And then just a few more questions because I'm

interested in this myself. So I know our listeners would be so the motorcycle

official business relationship, but all of the motorcycle rental operators tend to

know each other. And they do business with each other. So if I want to get a

fleet of bikes anywhere in the Iberian Peninsula, I might go with Scott Moreno from

IMT, depending on where the place is. And he's done a really good job for and he

has, he's, he's, he's number of the, one of the number ones in, in the world and

what he does. Okay. But then there's also mom and pop situations. Like if you go

out to a Western Australia, I've been known to go to a guy's, you know, garage and

he had a couple Harleys in there. And I rented one. So, you know, you have, it

runs the gamut. And it depends on the region. It also depends on, and we do our

due diligence. If we're going to go in with an operator and we don't know them and

we're going to bring guests there and spend real money and take up their real time

that we kind of want to know what we're doing so what we'll do is we'll

orchestrate a you know um what do they call it uh just a a recont tour or you

know just a a first time tour okay and and it's up front and some of our guests

really like that because They want to be the first to try it. But we also warn

them, this is what we're doing with this operator. You know, I always thought that

you didn't know anybody. You don't purchase a car from anybody until you go and

look at their garage and how they handle their garage. That's true. And you look

over their garage and you're like, okay, this person, you know, takes care of their

car. This one? Not so much. And we've learned through the years who to go with and

who specializes where. So we have regional operators. And what we usually do is go

to their place if they're big enough. But some of them are mobile these days. And

they'll trailer these bikes right to your hotel. Have them in the parking lot, ready

to go. And everything's been handled, sorted. We go over the bikes with everybody

and we're off to the races the next day. That's fun. That's funny what you say

about the garage because, you know, I recently got back on the dating apps, you

know. And I can see like a very good looking woman, but if she's standing in a

bedroom that looks like there's like clothes on the floor and the drawers are,

I don't care how hot she is, I'm moving on to the next one. Like, and I'm not

the Mr. Clean either, but if I'm seeing, you know, if you think that's a good

photo to put, you know, that tells me something about you. Absolutely. There's a lot

of layers to what you see or what they let you see before you make the purchase

so to speak all right so let's talk um you know um for this phyllis in in edison

new jersey or her dad who is maybe in his 50s what is the range of um spend can

it was like does it range from like two to eight thousand bucks for a like what

can i'm and we'll put you know links on to your site and instagram on the show

notes but just so people have a have a good idea yeah okay well if you're going

to rent from us it like a tour let's just talk about okay the tour side anything

fun is about 600 bucks a day okay and it'll it'll go up to over a thousand

dollars a day depending on what our destination is some tours come with you know

half bored some do not so there are some details that you want to be aware of

before you get into it for example i mean you show up in india and you don't have

to touch your wallet i mean if you want a beer you have to get a little bit of

rupees out but for the rest of it you float along japan is very similar you got

to get your own lunch and that's it but americans and i found this over we tried

to include everything in our packages in the united states for example it doesn't

work because uh one person's going to order a bowl of soup and then the other

one's going to order king crap and there's no way to find any and and part of

travel is to choose your own culinary adventure as well right so we leave that

freedom open uh so you're you're getting your hotel your motorcycle your guide on a

bike, your support staff with the truck. And sometimes depending on we,

they discovered they came up with the they found the check from the last supper and

it turns out it turns out everybody had like you know the same thing except for

paul who only had a bagel and a cup of coffee and he was pissed that he had to

that was his last right and he was like wait a second i didn't eat as much as

you guys just kind of ran in my head all right that's cool and then the last

thing and i actually have a very very good friend. Her name is Lauren. And she's

about 85 % recover. I mean, she's fine, you know, but she was doing a tour.

What was this, 25? So I think it was March of 24 in Spain.

She was writing a BMW 310. I'm not sure if she's in a group. I think she was in

a small group, but I'm not sure if it was organized to her. And she went down.

She had to be helicopter lifted to the nearest hospital.

The hospital that they brought her to in Spain, you would think a lot of doctors

would speak English. Nobody spoke English. So she had to wait until the time period

was the right time period for USA so she could have translators on the phone.

Thank God she had great insurance through her husband, who's a union guy. But if

she didn't have good insurance, she'd be screwed. And so I'm kind of curious, like,

do people, what do you recommend for people? I guess in the country, it's fine. You

have your normal insurance. But if you're going to Portugal or Nepal or India, do

you need a certain different type of medical insurance, would you say? Yeah, I mean,

that's an individual thing. You know, People tend to have insurances and think that

they're covered internationally. And if you read through our stuff when you register,

we ask that you do that. Do due diligence before you jump. But there's one thing,

and we've learned over the years, because we have had some challenges with some

wrecks in the past. And one thing that we do with no questions asked is when you

sign up for a package, you are enrolled in global rescue and global rescue is not

insurance. It's an extraction service. And what they do is they'll get you to the

safest, best location. And they'll also keep tabs on you,

keep calling you, keep making sure that you have translators, make sure that you're

taking care of. And they'll also reach out to your family and keep all of these

things connected until you're back we've had people flown from south america back to

the united states with this thing and then there's a little paperwork of course you

have to do but you will be reimbursed for any expenses you will not be on the

hook for those expenses and we don't we don't we don't even mess with that because

we know that we can get if it's a if it's a horrible accident and they need

treatment within that golden 24 we'll have a jet on a tom rack taking them where

they need to go and you don't fiddle with that so that's a separate service that

you recommend people we enroll everybody in it oh you do okay yeah they're in it

and some of them already have it but we're going to double down and some of them

don't even know what it is and it doesn't matter to us they're in it and they're

going to be taken care of that's great yeah do you You probably, have you heard of

a Lisa Klickinger? She's pretty famed. Oh, yeah, I know, Lisa. Yeah, she's the best.

She's the best in the world. And I tell you, certain things ring in my head, and

she's, like, big on hydration. And so whenever I go out, I always make sure I take

an extra half a liter or a liter of water because she was the one who told me

that, you know, it doesn't have to be hot to be dehydrated. And when you get beat

dehydrated, especially above 40 years old, which, you know, I am, you start, you

know, your decisions making gets a little weird, you know, when you're dehydrated,

even a little bit. So that's one of the things, and she's told me a lot of

things. And, you know, she's got a bear in her backyard. Have she told you about

this? No. No. She's got this, like, she lives in North Carolina. She moved back to

North Carolina. So every once in a while, she'll text me photos of, like, the bear

going in her garbage Big Ben, it's crazy. But anyway, but she's great. And why do

I, oh, yeah, because she's also affiliated. I don't know, maybe it is with that

company or a similar company that does that as well, like the extraction service and

they'll take you, you know, and make sure you're okay. I wonder if it's the sound

I'll have to ask her. But anyway, that's cool. All right. So now, Phil, you are

the co -founder and head of MotoQuest. What does that, co -founder and head of motor

quest, what do you, What bike do you ride every single day? What's your daily

rider? Ah, whatever they give me. What bike do you own? What bike is,

what, you have a registration for a motorcycle in your wallet right now, yes or no?

Well,

no.

Well, here's a deal. If you'd ask me that a year ago, I would have said I've

never, I don't own a motorcycle. I own part of 90 motorcycles. However,

I did end up. No, they're spread out between all of our rental locations up and

down the West Coast. However, let me put this another way. No,

I do now own a motorcycle. And it's a V -Straub. But the only reason I own it is

because it was stolen from my support vehicle in Christchurch, New Zealand, and

insurance wouldn't cover it. So I paid for it out of my pocket. And it's probably

went into a garage and it's parted out. But at least I own one.

All right. Let's say in June 26, June 1st of 2026, I get a few days off from

work. And for whatever reason, you happen to be in Anchorage, Alaska at home. And I

stopped by and I ring your bell. And I have a motorcycle with me. I say, hey,

Phil, let's go for a couple hour rides. What motorcycle will be in your garage that

you're going to take me for a ride around town? Well, I would, you know, I live

in Gurdwood just outside Anchorage. I would go to our shop in Anchorage. And I

would talk to our manager, Mike, and I'm like, Mike, what's free? And he'll go,

well, you could take number 86. And I was like, okay, it's a $12 .50 today. I'll

take that one. Like a BMW, probably. Yeah, probably. That's cool. All right.

Wow. So you don't really have your own personal motorcycle to call you.

Technically, I do.

The Vistram, but that is parted out. We don't know where it is. I'm not really

sure where it is. That is so funny. Okay. And these are the GS. Do you like RTs

too? I mean, I love my R -12 -R. I've written a GS before. I felt like I was on

a sailboat. I felt like I was almost too high. And, you know, and I like my R

-1200 R because I have the, I have the luggage so I can go anywhere. I have a

decent windshield. And I love the, you know, I love the boxer engine. I mean, I

have given more physics lessons to six -year -old kids, right? They'll I bought,

oh, sir, why is, why is the engine like that? I said, well, it's for balance and

it's easier to maintain, and it doesn't get all these wonderful, wonderful things.

But you must like the GS, I would think, right? Well, the GS for a rental bike is

more of a sure thing. We've had our T's, we've had LTs, we've had LTs, we've had

Indians, we've had Harleys, but we keep going back to the GS. And the reason is,

is you can ride gravel or dirt or you can even take it off road if you wanted

to. And half the highway system in Alaska is dirt. Wow. And,

you know, what we'll do is we usually get our fleet sourced from California.

And it's the first year they'll live down there and be on sealed roads. But then

eventually they will migrate to Alaska. And once they go to Pruto Bay, they're never

the same in that, you know, that salt and all that on the roadway is,

it's tough on them. And riding dirt is always hard on him. But it's a superior

model that it's all of the things that, you know. We had,

did you, did you, did you, uh, since you dealt with BMW, did you ever deal with

Trudy Hardy at BMW corporate? She was, uh, she was head of marketing,

chief marketing officer for BMW Motorrad, North South, and Central America. And, you

know, she's from New Jersey. That's where their office was. And a wonderful,

wonderful woman. When I did a Zoom with her, you know, most people have pictures of

their kids in the back or a closet like you have or whatever. But she had on her

wall hanging nine or ten helmets, different helmets.

And she would choose different ones depending. So she was a rider. She worked on

the launch of the mini Cooper when BMW bought that. And she was just so wonderful

to talk to. And she actually invited me down to Greer, South Carolina, do the two

-day BMW Advanced Riding course. Have you ever done that? Tell me a little about

your training. Okay, you were in Japan, you know, probably, you know, not a lot of

training there other than from your friend. Have you done formal safety training? I

did. Ironically, after I'd been running Alaska Rider tours, which was the first

company I started as a sole proprietor, I had done that for over seven years, going

all the way to Pruto Bay, leading tours. And then I finally got an opportunity to

do one of those weekend off -road courses, and I did it with Rahide, Jim Hyde, in

Castaic, California. We did a weekend deal there, and it just opened up my universe.

I thought that was great. I should have known this stuff before I went, you know,

but to Prudo all those times. So they really, it really helped me.

And I tell all of our riders that are going on adventure rides that they have got

to take one of those courses. If they really want to be number one safe and number

two if they want to enjoy their ride more because some of these people they're

signing up and they got a valid credit card but i'm not sure if they've thought it

through and so on our more adventures some tours because we're all about safety

because we got to stay safe as safe as this activity allows us to we vet them we

call them as soon as the registration comes through and we ask them about themselves

and you can learn a lot about somebody the minute you open that up and you can

learn about what they're capable of well i didn't realize i'd be hit by 50 file an

hour crosswinds on roly -poly gravel well yes you will are you really up for this

because we do have an alternative tour that is just as epic you know scenery -wise

it's just just not that notch on the belt. You know, you try to figure out if

they're right for the tour, if they really know what they're getting into. Some

people don't know what they're getting into. I hear you. You know, we have the

people we ride with range from, you know, 22 years old to 62 and even higher than

that. And I'm sure, you know, the people that have taken near tours are spending,

like you said, anywhere from, you know, $300 a day to thousand dollars a day means

they do good financially doesn't mean they're great motorcycle riders either way tell

me a little bit about and since it's mostly americans let's just stick with what

you've seen and not what we think is happening in other countries so tell me a

little bit about what are the most common flaws that the riders that you guide

typically have when they first start the tour and what should they work on and and

do you do you try to coach them or is that not really your job and I can

understand so let's start with one of the most common flaws that you're seeing in

most of the riders that you're leading I start every tour at the welcome dinner

which is included in the package with a with a toast and it is to a safe and

memorable trip and i mean it and i can't see everything that's going on behind me

but i can hear what's going on when i stop when people come up and go so -and

-so's doing so -and -so or they're they're doing this but it's i just thought you

ought to know and this and that and then the common things are that they're not

used to writing in a larger group group. So they're not in staggered formation. And

I tell everybody, give one, one thousand, two, one thousand, three, one thousand

between riders. They'll never do that. But if you give them three, at least they'll

do two, at least. And I say, whoever is behind me. And I don't care who you are.

And I get anybody from somebody who's brand new to a track coach behind me. And I

say, especially you give me more because I am the canary in the coal mine and

whatever jumps out in front of me or whatever's in front if I see diesel on the

road or blah blah blah I'm going to hit the brakes and my writing style is not

it's not you know I've been to writing schools I don't hit the brakes unless I

really really need to and if you see my brakes light up you ought to be aware of

it I don't want to get hit from behind I don't want both of us staring at each

other and I had this talk Thank you.

if something happens you know there's no out and another so the writing in the

seconds between the riders the other thing that happens is if they're not used to a

group ride many times they'll be like a butterfly they're just looking over here

then they go over there then they're over there and then they're over there and

then no one wants to ride behind them right that has ridden with a group and then

they tell you and then there's a conflict of who gets to ride where in the group

and how we're going to figure this out and I try to, I'm like, do I have to

take.

And, you know, the first day, you kind of have them all together. Right. And I'm

pretty upfront about it. I don't care if you pass each other, but pass each other

safely. Tell them about the staggered. Tell them about the time in between. And then

we kind of see how it flows. And usually by the fourth day, everyone kind of knows

everybody, especially the first day. I don't mind if you ride on your own either.

Some people prefer it. But I just want to kind of gauge you the first day. And

then after that, We'll figure it out. And it usually works out. Got it. And,

you know, so it's funny, you mentioned people kind of passing when they're not

supposed to. And the motorcycle safety foundation might disagree with what I'm about

to say. But I feel loud pipes do save lives most, if not,

all of the time. Because some of the guys that we ride with, and gals, quite

frankly, we ride this one Polish woman. She's from Poland, from Warsaw,

and I forgot what bikes she's got, but you can hear her a mile before she gets

there, right? And so if she's, we're in a staggered formation, and she's coming up

on me, I can actually hear her even though she's behind me, and that helps me.

What is your personal feeling? Now, I know you're leading a bunch of BMWs, which,

you know, often the joke is that, You know, they sound like, you know, my mother's

singer -sewing machine with what they're stuck, you know, and that's how my first

bike was, the R -1100 R. But what's your view, not even just for a touring bike,

for street bikes, what's your view on aftermarket pipes and saving lives and just

for the average rider? I don't, I don't really have an opinion. I'm pretty middle

of the road on that. Okay. You know, the The first bike that I had that Honda

talked about had a really loud pipe. It was an aftermarket. As for saving lives or

not, people will hear you. I agree with you. And I also think you should wear

something that catches the eye theoretically. I'm not always wearing something like

that. But I think that that is a responsibility on you as you're choosing to be on

a motorcycle. But I also feel like if you're on a motorcycle that you're very

comfortable with. And I like the Enduro chassis because it's very forgiving that it

has a lot longer suspension travel and you can accelerate and stop faster than any

car around you and you have a field of vision that's unobstructed. So it's on you

to be the careful person and to navigate around the danger. Yeah,

and let them know you're there. If you have to, in India, you have to haunt if

you're going to pass somebody, you know. But it depends on the culture. You don't

want to do that on the 405 so much in California. But, you know,

be seen, you know, and go at a clip where you feel like it's safe. Don't do

something stupid. Yeah, I agree. And I think, I don't think you need a cut pipe

that, you know, is waking the neighbors at 6 o 'clock in the morning. But I think

I had the agoraphobic pipe on my last bike. And I almost used it like a horn

around town where, you know, I would rev it just, and especially in the city. When

you come to Manhattan, you'll see that you need a freaking nice pipe to let people

know where you are because people, people will FaceTime while crossing the street

against the light in Manhattan and then you as a motorcyclist are going to the

speed limit and they look at you like you're an idiot and I'm like, I can be a

little sarcastic sometimes and I say to them, gee, I wonder what the red hand on

the light means. It means don't fucking cross. And one time I said to this woman

I said to her, I said, listen, because she did something dangerous like she was

totally and a car almost hit her not even me and I said to her if there's anybody

in your life that loves you or you love them you cannot be looking down at your

phone in a crosswalk where even if you have the light because these taxi drivers

everybody oh that brings me to the next question so but don't so everybody that's

what I mean there so you have a lot of nice people, wealthy people, whatever, and

I'm sure they're tied to their iPhones or their androids or whatever, what advice

are you giving them as far as, you know, I don't know if they have the helmet

speakers and they can talk to their wives in Iowa on the truck. Like, what are you

telling them about distracted riding, texting riding, that type of thing on the tour?

And then let's also move to like the average Joe Schmoe in Cincinnati, Ohio. What

are you telling people about having your phone on the handlebars and messing around

with it? Yeah, I don't really get into that realm. I haven't had any trouble with

that so far. I do encourage people to have, you know, a phone mount if they want

to stay along with the adventure because we do, you know, waypoints along. I send

them out every morning and people know where we're going and a lot of like i would

say 70 % of people they don't they really follow it and they don't care they're on

a tour they want to just follow the leader and then do that there are 30 % they

want to be on it haven't had that as much of a distraction i have a lot of

people that want to know if i want to connect with them on with the cardio yeah

and talk with them and that's the last thing i want to do is listen to somebody's

feelings while i'm in my own my own realm of this is my relief zone yeah right

please don't take away my helmet time and also i don't do any music i do earplugs

and i figure i'm going to stay focused on what's going on around me in front of

me and behind me uh i don't tell somebody not to do it but i don't see that many

bad habits you know mostly it's about you know what i hear from the back or people

that are unfamiliar to ride in a group and they're just, they feel unsafe. And then

you have that fluttery rider that's just, they just ride like they think. They're

just, you know, squirrel and all over. And they don't even have a phone and they

don't have music. They're just that way. I try to tell them, hey, you know, kind

of maintain your lane if you're going to ride in the group. Yeah, I mean, I think

I've taken a couple of safety courses. And I had this one woman, Monica Holmes, who

is a very accomplished MSF instructor. She lives in North Jersey, and she would tell

me, you know, it's New York City, right? I mean, everybody's attached to their

phones, but she would try to tell the people, listen,

if you're riding four years or less, put the phone in your pocket, and if you need

directions, or if you need to know when that weighs, because I don't know if you

guys have speed cameras up in Alaska or whatever but we got a ton over here so a

lot of people like their excuse for having the phone on the handlebar is oh I want

to see where the speed camera no no put your phone in your pocket and and put

your headphones on we had this other woman from Oregon oh I'm spacing on her name

what a woman she had a ducati and she took the speedometer off of it so if she

ever got caught by a cop, and the cop asked her, do you know how fast you were

going? She could honestly say I don't because I don't have a speedometer. But she

was in a crash once, and the bike was like 70 yards away, and because she had her

phone in her pocket, she was able to call for help. But if that phone was on her

handlebars, she would have been stranded there for like a day and a half. So you

have to keep that in mind, too. So I would recommend, you know, I'm older,

so my attention span is not what it used to be. Maybe if you're younger, but, you

know, we have so many distractions. And another thing is, I don't know, how is

Alaska up there? I know you ride all over the world, too, but is our distracted

drivers a bad problem in Alaska with people texting and do everything but driving up

there? It's getting worse. Yeah.

And that's the other reason you need to be, you know, it used to be, you had this

woman, Jamie, on the show, and she's from Taiwan, but she would, her rule of thumb

was she would never ride after 10 o 'clock on a Friday or Saturday, because that's

when people would be drinking. But the people actually are drinking and driving much

less because of Uber and Lyft now. They just call an Uber. But so that's the good

news. The bad news is distracted driving is worse than drunk driving. And that can

happen at any part in the day. I'm more worried about that. It's on my mind every

day. For sure. Especially in the States. You know, you get into third world

countries or so you don't, I don't, I haven't seen it as much, but it seems like

America's the hotbed for that. Have you let a chore in India? I have.

All right. So tell me this, because I got to know. So on the internet, on YouTube,

we see all these videos of like an Indian family of like eight people and they

have like a Honda 125cc and they have it loaded. Like,

is that a real thing that people do there? That's going on a million different ways

right now. Really? It's unbelievable. It's Star Wars traffic in New Delhi,

for example. Everything And, yeah, I've seen an entire family. I've been passed by

entire families on a no pet.

Wow. That is funny. All right.

This has been good. You got a few more minutes? You got like 10 more minutes?

Yeah, sure. Okay, cool. Do

you remember? So you took the course. Do You remember a show called I Dream of

Jeannie? Of course. Okay. So you remember Jeannie could grant a wish, you know,

pretty easily. Let's say we had Barbara Eden, who's still alive and looks pretty

good. I think she's like 94. Let's say she was here with us. And with one wish,

she could make one aspect of your riding skills five times better than it is right

now. What would you ask, what wish, what writing skill wish magnification would you

ask her for? Gosh, you know, I want to say, my knee jerk is awareness,

but that's a pretty bland answer. Well, being more aware is not bad, yeah. Well,

yeah, or know your equipment, understand what you've got, you um know the capability

just know your limits i guess okay know your limits of your motorcycle and know

your limit your own skilled limits both of them are variables and ride uh within

those whatever the bike is ride within the limits of that okay that's good and then

wherever you are in your life you know because our reactions aren't getting any

better you know that's for sure You know, a lot of people say cornering for me,

you know, we went on a trip. I wouldn't have said this three months ago, but I

would say it now. And maybe you could, we were in upstate, you know, two hours

north of the city. And I was getting blown, and I'm a big guy. I'm six feet, and

I'm over 300 pounds. And my bike is like 450 pounds. And I was getting tossed

around like a kite on a March day. And that was scary it was even more scary than

riding in the rain sometimes what do you tell people like about riding are you

riding into it against it like what what are you telling people yeah right i mean

we have a uh a ride in patagonia and it is windy everyone says it's windy but go

to patagonia and tell me And we had a day in Iceland as well. You know, that

North Atlantic doesn't have any wind barrier. So the Icelandics have an interesting

way of doing it. What they'll do is whatever side you're getting hit with by the

wind, you put your foot on the foot peg and point your toe towards the wind.

And then that'll make you, your leg kind of cock out a little bit.

And you'll be facing into the wind. And their theory is that that will handle the

wind. That will be your automatic wind directional direction.

And I think it's funny and I don't do it. But I thought it was pretty funny.

Man, I've been in winds in Patagonia where you're scraping the peg along the road.

No, I'm not. It was hitting the and you're you know your body and your equilibrium

as long as you keep focused frontwards you got your feet on your bags your body

just kind of takes it and you just kind of swivel back and forth and there's

nothing fun about it uh and when we get on gravel surfaces where i've had groups

where we're getting blown but you know 50 mile an hour crosswinds no oak, especially

if it's not, if it's variable. And those roads on the Route 40 in Argentina are

straight, they're gravel and they're rutted. And they're little pea gravel. So you're

in a rut because that's your better grip. And then all of a sudden you get it

disgust. And it picks you over. You go over about 10 inches of just really dodgy

pea gravel. And then you got a, you got to drop a gear and throttle and look to

where you're going to go, which is the next rut. And there's nothing fun about it.

It's pretty dodgy. I've had riders get blown right off the road, and then they make

their way back on the road. And that's a full day of just adrenaline, and it's

nuts. And it's fatiguing, right? Not only is it's, and then, you know, in the

highways here, sometimes, you know, you're passing a bus or an 18 -wheeler and you

don't realize the wind until you pass it and then that's you know surprising so you

always have to be aware and people wonder why you know I'll be home and my mother

god bless her she's the amazing but you know I'll take a four -hour ride with

friends upstate a couple hundred miles and my mom's so tired she's like how can you

be so tired you're just sitting on your butt on a bike but you don't realize it's

like your mind is going your muscles are going your feet is going Um, two more

questions then I'll let you go. Um,

so, so it's winter here and in Alaska. Um, do you have,

so we got to find a way to, to pass the time. Do you have any favorite motorcycle

movies that you like to watch? Motorcycle movies, huh? Well, how can you beat that

last scene in The Great Escape. That's a tough one. That's a tough one. Have you

seen why we ride? I have. I very much enjoyed it. I've seen it 30 times. I had

Brian Carroll on the show my first season. And I said to him, straight out, I

said, listen, I've seen your film at least 20 times. And I cry, like, half the

time I watch it. It's so, like, touching, you know, the music and everything. And

I've had Alonzo Bowden, if you know him, I've had him on the show twice he's a

you know big guy and he's uh he's a comedian stand -up comedian that's a great one

easy riders what how can you be when you go into the motorcycle genre how can you

beat on any sunday uh it's tough well why we ride is like the the modern version

of on exactly i would say so yeah and taking these guys that basically don't have

the funds to do the racing they're taking so much risk and they they love it for

the sport of it and that last scene when they're down by san diego and there's

three of them winding in and out of cow pies trying to put it on each other that

was a really good tie that was a good one uh and i just recently watched easy

rider again for i probably haven't seen like eight or nine years and uh it's

different because you see you you bring you're at a different point in your life

and it's just amazing what they saw yeah do they you know they got drug money to

get the bikes and all that stuff but they were pretty much other than that they

were good guys just looking to meet people and do their own thing and Dennis Hopper

gosh I guess they're both dead right Peter Fonda's been dead a while I think Dennis

Hopper recently died but anyway um my other thing I was oh so let's go back let's

go let's see it's 2025 so soon to be 26 So let's go, I know you've been riding a

lot of years. So let's go, can you name, like, a most memorable,

happy memorable, not sad memorable. So a happy moment in the last, let's say,

15 years on a motorcycle that sticks out.

Ah, in the last 15 years. Yeah, it could be personal, like on a personal ride or

on a tour. And Tell me about that moment. Well, you know,

sometimes something happens during the day where I got to get on a motorcycle, you

know, after we get into the hotel and I got to go back and do something or

something like that. And I'm alone. That doesn't happen very often when I'm on the

clock. This has nothing to do with what I just thought of, though. I was leading a

tour a few years ago in Japan and I do the same cherry blossom tour. It's the

same route based on a friend who put it together. And I was shopping for something

new and there's lots of great roads there and it doesn't matter which one you pick.

And I saw this loop as I was riding that I could perhaps do and it'll be new to

me and it'll be something for them. They had no idea I was calling an audible.

I just, I looked at that road. Neither did my driver who was trying to follow me.

We play this game where she tries to figure out where I'm going because I don't

even know where I'm going sometimes. And I stitched together this ride and it turned

out to be one of those wonderful rides where it just, the energy just came all the

way up and the, the scenery was so classically Japanese with the roof lines,

the very manicured rice fields.

climbed and it sang to you as you were working through the gears and i don't know

about you but going uphill more than downhill and going up through the gears and i

just thought are you kidding me this country is riddled with these things and no

one's talking about it this is the best writing there is if there is any it's

engineered perfect and everybody behind me has no idea that i'm not lost but i'm

not sure where i'm at that's a good one it'll need to know all that we're going

to

And, man, I'd love to see your camera roll. Are you a Mac guy? Like, you must

have tens of thousands of photos. It's great, like, right? Are you stabbing up with

your phone, or are you using a regular camera? I'm usually with my phone these

days. Wow. But I was going due west on an August afternoon,

5 o 'clock, 5 30, there was not a cloud in the sky, which normally would be good,

except the sun sets in the west. And it was 90 degrees out. And so I rode 60

miles, and I didn't see a thing in front of me, except bright sunlight, except when

I had my hand in front of me, and I could see a little bit. And I just said to

myself, you know, I got to stop for a little while, because I can't see anything.

And then the sun just kind I went down, but it was still kind of light, you know.

And then I see, I see a sign that says, welcome to Canada, like two miles, like

to Canada, two miles. And I think I came into Canada via some side door because

they didn't come in through the main, I mean, I still have to go over customs, but

I didn't come through Route 90, which is like the way most people come because

there was a detour. And then it started getting cooler. It went from 90 to about

70, and it was dusk and you know you get that that that that rush of air you

know it was just really really and I love being on you know on the bike um you

know around Niagara Falls and you know and we all have to take a photo for

Instagram these days right so I parked in a mostly illegal area just to get a good

photo of me and the bike by the falls and you know there's like tens of thousands

of people around Niagara Falls from every country in the world. And I will see this

woman walking towards me. And I say, excuse me, ma 'am, could you take my photo

real quick? You know, and she's like, sure, sure. And we got to talking, and it

turns out she lives like 15 blocks north of where I live in Manhattan, like small,

freaking one. It's crazy. I hear you have a mixture of meeting somebody on the road

and 20 degrees difference and a little bit of freedom. Yes, yes, this is,

well, this has been great. We will put links to, and so these things start filling

up, right? So you, let me have tours, what do they start? Like March, that would

go March to September for the most part? Your tour is April 2? All year long. Oh,

you do go all year, okay. But January, I'm sure the winter ones are probably in

the southern U .S. and southern areas. Oh, we have the Baja season. That's our Baja

season is January, February, and March. We'll take groups out of Long Beach and go

down to Cabo. So how many people will do a MotoQuest tour in a given year?

It's like a few thousand? Oh, man, I don't know. I mean, we're into the couple

hundreds at least. For sure. And then, and also the motor rental by, you know, I

had the CEO of RiderShare. Do you know him? I'm spacing on his name. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And he was, he's a great guy. Well, we're, when I first started this,

I had a tarp out front and I had three used motorcycles underneath it.

And now we have a fleet of, what, 90 plus Gs is. Right. And We're running tours

sometimes four at a time around the world at any given time. Son of a gun. I

can't even believe the logistics on it. But I was very fortunate to meet people who

saw the vision of this and wanted to be a part of it and then want to build a

team that wanted to organize it. So there's no way I could have done any of that.

You have to have a team. And I got lucky. So like when people retire,

they will do stuff they like, like retire and take motorcycle trips, but that's your

day job. Like, do you see yourself, you know, but I can also understand,

like, if you do, you know, I'm sure you'll retire one day, hopefully, but you'll

probably retire and not want to deal with all the headaches because I'm sure, I

mean, I'm the son of a small business owner. I didn't know my father, I mean, I

knew my father, but I didn't know him that well from the age of six to about 16

because that's when he was

or you work 16 days or 16 hours a day it's just up to you which 16 hours are

going to be okay and i believe it but it's all 16 if you got to sleep eight

hours but uh you know i've been at it what is we're at year 26 now 27 and uh

i've been out of a long long time but like i said i got a really good team and

they they actually have taken the baton And that is really, I think, part of the

evolution of starting a business is that, essentially, are you going to sell it? And

if you do, are you going to build a team or have a team there in place so that

it can go to the next level? And how long will this thing? And my vision of

MotorQuest is to outlive me.

And I put everything I've ever had into it, time and money. If you look at my

bank account, you're like, really? But then if I think about my rolodex of memories,

I've had some pretty amazing ones and I've been able to meet amazing people. But

having that said, I think this thing's going to make it. There are, there's, I

think I got another 10 years in me. And I don't know if I'm really geared to work

anywhere else. There's no way. And, but also it's a matter of discipline to probably

pull back a little bit and not have the control of all the things and let it

organically get to where it needs to go let the water and the sunlight and the

wind do the magic on the plant and i think that's where we're kind of at we're

going you brought up another point then so elisa clinger has written three or four

books and she's written all over the planet right and she's you know she's led

women motorcycle tours as you probably know do you have a book or two in you well

i have written one so far co third with Lee Clancher from Octane Press,

and it is the adventurous motorcyclist guide to Alaska. It's actually an award

-winning guidebook, and I'm really proud of it, and Lee did a great job. We

collaborated 100%, and he was mostly penning it, and he did a beautiful job. He's a

great photographer. He asked me to send him a couple photos for the book, and he

said, I asked you for a couple photos, Bill, but 40 ,000. Oh, my God.

But I'm working on a memoir now, and it's in the background, and I have a mentor

that is a New York Times bestseller looking over it. Oh, good. And I'm, I've got a

space of time because finally I do. And I'm chugging away. Don't be surprised in

another two years. You see something come out. All right. So listen, next spring or

summer, find a way to get to New York on a day for a few days. You've got to

meet everybody over here. And the few people that know Aileen, you know, I would

say 40, you know, New York is a melting pot, right? I don't know how it is in

Alaska. But if there's 400 people at our meetups, there's 270 Hispanic Latinos,

probably 120 African Americans, another 60 of some type of Asian,

Chinese, Japanese, Southeast Asian, about 20 % Indian. It's such a melting pot.

You would love it and you would love our two -wheel Tuesdays, and we'll find a bike

for you. Oh, I'm calling you up. If I make it out there, when I do, I'll let

you. That's cool. Well, Phil, is great to have you on the show. We'll have links

in the show notes. Appreciate you stopping by. Yeah, thanks a lot for the invite. I

appreciate it, Len.

Okay, cool. We'll cut there. All right, excellent. Thank you again. What I'll need

from you, if you don't mind, I'm sure you got them. Give me one or two photos

that I can use for the cover art that has a photo, since you don't own your own

personal bike, a photo of you where I can see your face, you can wear whatever

gear you want, obviously. But a photo of you and a motorcycle where I can see your

face that I can use for the cover art. If you give me maybe two of those so I

can kind of see what works best with the cover art, would that be okay? Sure, no

problem. Okay, cool. And then what I'll do is, so do you, like, you know, me and

you, I think we're, you know, definitely Gen X, I would say,

are you a big instant? Like, for the, for the business, do a lot of people find

you via Instagram, via Google, via Word of, I mean, I know it's all three, but Is

Instagram huge for you guys? Man, I would say Google search is probably number one.

Okay. Facebook and Insta are doing okay, but they're not our main.

And then word of mouth is what really sells it. The minute a friend tells a

friend, that's when the comma 0 -000 price tag is reasonable.

Got it. Got it. And it's funny. The CEO of Ryder's share,

I'm forgetting his, Alberto? I forgot his name, but anyway. I think it is a Latin

name. Yeah, no, he used to work for Nissan. And he's a big data guy. And he would

tell me, you know, he sees every rental that comes through, you know, either on his

phone or whatever. And he says he can predict with very good accuracy the chances

of somebody getting in a wreck just by like their age how many yeah unfortunately

it's an interesting model though isn't it renting other I know they do it with cars

yeah I it doesn't settle well with me uh knowing what kind of damages you can get

because uh the push and pull of this whole business is after the dust settles and

someone does himself off and the bike is carted over to the mechanic then that's

the rub is how much it's going to cost them. And then there's the ego. It wasn't

my fault. Oh, gosh, that's when the tug of war. And so if there's a sight unseen

sort of situation,

and not everybody, not even the most religious of people I've had on my tours,

will admit that their bike toppled over if the guy didn't see it. Oh, see what I

see what she's saying. Yeah, no, well, and that's why he doesn't rent in New York

State because he said he'd have to charge $80 a day insurance. So in Jersey,

now what a lot of people do if they want to, if they live in the city, they'll

go out to Jersey and do her. And a lot of guys, it's almost like Airbnb too. Some

guys will just buy like three Hondas, three Royal Enfields and keep them as rider

share bikes and just, you know, make some money off of them like people do with

that the service for cars i forgot what it's called but um yeah it is what it is

so we'll see all right so what do you got uh what else you got going on this oh

have you ever met sarah palin no no i but i i have friends that are i think she

rides a harley though doesn't she ride a harley somebody said well if someone asked

her too she would she yeah yeah everybody kind of knows everybody or at least knows

somebody has been in the room with her my sister's been in the room with her so

let me go yeah all right cool all right so uh thanks again email me the photos

and when it goes live obviously i'll tell you you can socialize it on your

instagram facebook whatever you want to do that would be cool okay appreciate it i

might put it on motor quest newsletter as well. Oh, that would be great. That would

be great. Awesome. All right, have a good rest of the week. Take care. All right.

Thank you, bye. Bye.